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Posted on 19-10-03, 05:19
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Posted by funkyass
Microsoft got into trouble due to exclusivity deals for windows/dos with a handful of major manufacturers, and shipping their OS in a manner that reduced choice to those new to computing. At the time of the case, you couldn't ship windows 9x without IE - you can ship an android without chrome, or any of google's apps.
Similar thing happened with either Windows XP or Windows Vista, resulting in Microsoft Windows asking you which Web Browser you'd like to use with it listing common browsers to choose from, the first time you attempt to open Internet Explorer.

At least in the UK I think? It's the N editions of Windows which have this behaviour.

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Posted on 19-10-03, 05:53
Secretly, I'm PZ Myers

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Do the various chromia at least offer different features?
Posted on 19-10-03, 06:25 (revision 1)
Custom title here

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Posted by Nicholas Steel
Posted by funkyass
Microsoft got into trouble due to exclusivity deals for windows/dos with a handful of major manufacturers, and shipping their OS in a manner that reduced choice to those new to computing. At the time of the case, you couldn't ship windows 9x without IE - you can ship an android without chrome, or any of google's apps.
Similar thing happened with either Windows XP or Windows Vista, resulting in Microsoft Windows asking you which Web Browser you'd like to use with it listing common browsers to choose from, the first time you attempt to open Internet Explorer.

At least in the UK I think? It's the N editions of Windows which have this behaviour.
Yeah, that was only ever a thing in Europe. In America, Microsoft explicitly forbade computer companies from installing Firefox or Chrome on their Windows machines, and that was okay because the purchasers could still go to firefox.com to get Firefox or any other URL on the internet to get Chrome, so they weren't FORCING anyone to use IE.

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Posted on 19-10-03, 08:09
Dick Duck

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Hence the "IE's only task is to download Firefox/Chrome" joke, no matter if you're American or European.
Posted on 19-10-03, 08:55 (revision 1)
Custom title here

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Posted by Kawa
Hence the "IE's only task is to download Firefox/Chrome" joke, no matter if you're American or European.

I set Edge up to delete cookies on close, and use it to view sites I think are bad at minding their own business.
...
And for downloading Seamonkey.



But the "download Firefox" thing was for the portion of the populace that cared, which was never a majority.
And the "download Chrome" thing is... well, due to Google's ad dominance. Any Google website will throw up a "harder better faster stronger browser, download Chrome" ad when you visit it with a non-Chrome browser.

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Posted on 19-10-03, 09:06 (revision 1)
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On a tangent note, trying to build a small footprint embedded system with a kiosk-style webapp on top, and in the market for a small-ish webbrowser. Needs to tick the following boxes:

* Wayland support (found a large tech company to sponsor parts, but part of the deal is that I use Wayland)
* HTML5 (partial is fine as long as it has the parts I need)
* CSS2.1+
* Basic JS and DOM support
* Kiosk mode
* On-screen keyboard (could be solved from the OS itself with a Wayland on-screen keyboard)
* Everything (OS+GUI+Webapp) comfortably fits on a 512MB internal flash storage (that's the size the dev kit uses)

My options so far:

* Firefox - big and bloated (100+ MB), supports all I do, no support for on-screen keyboard
* Dillo - small, lean, and only supports HTML 3.2, no JS or Wayland support
* Chromium - SUPER bloated (~200 MB!!!), does tick all other boxes but leaves very little left for programs on a 512 MB SD card
* Opera/Vivaldi - Only supports Xorg

Also interested in Yocto as a build tool, so plus if it exists as a Yocto package, but if need be I can roll my own. Any comments?
Posted on 19-10-03, 10:32 (revision 1)
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sounds like something that would end up on a cheap android tablet... going to a bigger SD card can't be that much of a hassle, would it?
Posted on 19-10-03, 12:36 (revision 1)
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Industrial use, so flash memory comes at an absolute premium due to being certified for 25+ years. Actually, we would like to get away with 256MB use, but that might be too limited.
Posted on 19-10-03, 14:58
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Midori and Netsurf are small, lean, and have limited HTML support too. Falkon is based off QWebEngine and Chromium. IDK what else exists.
Posted on 19-10-03, 21:30
Custom title here

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You gonna have to code your own browser!

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Posted on 19-10-03, 22:01
I was frozen today!

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With blackjack and hookers!
Posted on 19-10-03, 23:36
Custom title here

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Posted by Kawa
With blackjack and hookers!
Well, OBVIOUSLY. I thoughtt that went without saying.

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Posted on 19-10-04, 11:56
Not from my cellphone

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I thought that if you wanted blackjack and hookers, you needed VC money and an IPO for that...

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Posted on 19-10-04, 12:10
Custom title here

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Posted by tomman
I thought that if you wanted blackjack and hookers, you needed VC money and an IPO for that...
Somethinsomethin dark web yaddayadda tor blahblah silk road buttcoin et cetera

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Posted on 19-11-01, 06:39
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Disabling the ability to Side Load extensions in v74: https://blog.mozilla.org/addons/2019/10/31/firefox-to-discontinue-sideloaded-extensions/

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Posted on 19-11-01, 06:54
Custom title here

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Posted by Nicholas Steel
Disabling the ability to Side Load extensions in v74: https://blog.mozilla.org/addons/2019/10/31/firefox-to-discontinue-sideloaded-extensions/

A. Sideloading is a stupid term and I hate whoever coined it.
B. So... if I read this right, they mean you can't have system-wide extensions now, and they have to be installed per-account? That's dumb.
C. Sideloading is a stupid term and I hate whoever coined it.

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Posted on 19-11-01, 09:51
Not from my cellphone

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To be fair, the only case of system-wide extensions I've seen is adware/spyware shit dropped by shitware installers.
In that case, GOOD RIDDANCE!

...but then, I'm only speaking about consumer-level scenarios. Once again, this has the potential to screw up enterprise-level deployments. But that's OK since Mozilla has never given a damn on "Firefox in the enterprise" anyway.

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Posted on 19-11-01, 10:19
Full mod

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Debian provides (or provided) system packages for popular Firefox and Thunderbird extensions, although I don't know how many people actually used them.

I also heard of somebody who wrote a "translate this page" extension that worked by injecting the JS blob that Google Translate provides for webmasters to add to their own websites. They couldn't upload it to AMO because Mozilla forbids extensions that inject third-party JS into webpages, and now they can't side-load it either.

On the other hand, I'm willing to bet that far more spyware, malware, and anti-virus "web security" extensions have been sideloaded than actual useful extensions. I wish humans weren't so terrible.

The ending of the words is ALMSIVI.
Posted on 19-11-01, 23:03 (revision 1)
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Could the "translate this page" extension be implemented as a userscript?

- tampermonkey
- violentmonkey with default injection mode set to auto (otherwise it will fail on many sites... why don't they do that by default? https://github.com/violentmonkey/violentmonkey/issues/597 )
- I heard there's an extension which uses Firefox's native userscript support, and also supports userstyles. But I'm not using it. Violentmonkey is good enough for userescripts, and Stylus supports toggling scripts without reloading the page (the new extension doesn't).
Posted on 19-11-02, 05:49
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IIRC, Mozilla is planning on implementing the translate page natively in firefox sometime next year.
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