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    Thread review
    tomman The Japanese Internet surely its a product of its time, and I guess that for a native, all that clutter is actually an advantage, as Japanese (and Chinese) are languages whose pictographic character sets give them an unique advantage that our Latin-based alphabets can't (doesn't meant the West hasn't been trying... but we got the emoji disease instead!). On the flip side, Japan sees pointless whitespace as a bug, not a feature~

    And even then, that doesn't mean that Japan is Modern Webshit™-free, as the Chromeisms are silently infecting the land of the rising sun, slowly but steady:

    - Pixiv has become a glorified SPA: bloaty, slow, and unusable without JavaScript
    - Fanbox goes even further, and completely breaks without Google WebComponents®
    - I've even seen doujin-related sites following this horrible trend of adopting the latest Chromeisms: for example, as of the 2021 edition, you couldn't vote anymore on the Touhou Popularity Contests if you weren't using Holy Chrome or latest Firefucked (again: Google WebComponents®)
    creaothceann https://old.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/t5gsaf/why_japanese_web_design_is_so_different_cultural/

    Apparently the consensus isn't as clear-cut as one might think.
    CaptainJistuce Well, part of the problem is browsers having their own text rendering engine with its own antialiasing functions. And then, even if the browsers check and respect the OS settings, offering websites the choice to override browser text antialiasing settings.

    And even if you fix the browsers and kill their site overrides, there's all the applications that use an embedded, nonconfigurable HTML rendering engine as a part of them.
    tomman Well, I can't live without subpixel aliasing - it's the first thing I setup on any new PC that doesn't ship with that enabled out of the box, and thankfully modern, non-braindamaged Linux DEs allow some degree of tweaking over it.

    What we need is to empower the user to do whatever the fuck he/she/it wants, AND RESPECT HIS/HER/ITS FUCKING ORDERS, not to convince that Apple/Google is always right and the user is dumb. If you don't want subpixel AA but your computer insists into reenabling it out of the blue, something is really wrong with UX. Same as any developer insisting that nobody needs $FEATURE and everybody inside their bubble is buying $2000+ in new computer gear every year.

    My computer, my rules. Let me have my cake AND eat it.
    CaptainJistuce Good riddance. Subpixel antialiasing is a misfeature that has caused me nothing but trouble as everything tries to re-enable it over my express command not to.
    tomman Speaking of serial UX offenders: a bunch of GNOMEs believe noone needs subpixel rendering anymore because They Say So:
    https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gtk/-/merge_requests/3393

    In particular the excuses given by this snowflake are downright stupid, and can be condensed down to this pile of manure:

    - "Everybody is buying UHD displays these days"
    - "Google/Apple stopped doing it, so we should do so too"
    - "Control panels and preferences are harmful for users"


    I'm glad I am not a GNOME user, but sadly all this assbackwardery also hits GTK4, so...
    creaothceann https://i.imgur.com/rKdPM0Z.png (filen)

    One of these is a zero, the other one is a lowercase "o"...
    tomman Places like MercadoLibre do exactly the same shit:

    - Static HTML for rendering the pages, which works even with JS off (but NOT inside NOSCRIPT tags!)
    - Plus a unhealthy big blob of JSON (we're talking of several hundreds of kilobytes just for a product listing page) for re-rendering the pages with their abomination of homebrew JS framework

    I learned this the hard way when I was having the unexplained CPU hogs on Seamonkey - turns out this malpractice breaks all hell loose in browsers' rendering engines and JS engines (in the case of SM, handling of timers and the NS-era throbber got involved, IIRC), for no good reason at all.

    JavaScript is one of mankinds' worst mistakes, make no doubt of it. And now, deranged nerds funded by unlimited VC money are trying to rewrite the world in JavaScript, one module at a time.

    $DEITY have mercy of us...
    Kawaoneechan Holy shit that's horrifying.
    creaothceann This seems to fit here...

    Hahahahaha. The content itself is in the fucking HTML - but hidden behind a <noscript> tag! So if you're browsing the site without JS, you just see the content immediately, but if your browser has JS enabled, you have to wait for the HTML to load completely (including the content), for the browser to parse the HTML and send a request to a javascript source file, wait for the javascript to load, get parsed, get to the point in execution where it sends a GET request to an API which serves the content, wait for the GET request to complete, the giant JSON payload to get parsed, and then finally JavaScript can do the DOM operations necessary to populate the body.

    So with JavaScript disabled:

    1. GET request to /hillelwayne/archive/i-ing-hate-science/
    2. The response contains the post contents, so rendering of content starts even before all the HTML is downloaded

    With JavaScript enabled:

    1. GET request to /hillelwayne/archive/i-ing-hate-science/
    2. Once the entire HTML body is downloaded, GET request to /.../main-<hash>.js
    3. Once the entire JS script is download, parsed and executed, GET request to /api/emails/...
    4. Once the entire JSON payload is downloaded, parse the JSON payload
    5. Once the entire JSON payload is parsed, populate the body

    Why do people make websites like this?

    The funny thing is: The script which actually loads the e-mail is at the very bottom of the HTML. Normally, putting scripts at the bottom of the HTML is good practice, because you want the content to be loaded first, and JavaScript to be loaded after the content. But in this case, the javascript loads the content, so it's critical to start downloading it as soon as possible. The script tag should've been close to the very top of the HTML. But it's not, so the script which loads the actual content of the page is going to be loaded with essentially the lowest priority possible by the browser, and the browser won't even know about it before the entire post body is loaded (due to that aforementioned noscript tag).



    EDIT: formatting
    Kawaoneechan Skreeonk!

    No wait that's Godzilla.
    tomman CLOSED WORKSFORME WONTFIX YOUREDOINGITWRONG NOLONGERWELCOMEHERE

    Jeff Asswood thinks you're a dinosaur.
    ‮strfry("emanresu") Man, I hate discourse.

    Today, I wanted to do a fairly simple action: find all posts by user in this thread.

    On a reasonable forum, how would it be done?

    CTRL-F "username", done.

    However, with the "new technology" of treating the browser as an obstacle you want to get rid of and using JavaScript+XHR+JSON to build the page this flies out of the window.

    To "fix" this, discourse graciously pops up the "search in forum" box instead. Which might work fine if you were looking for what they wrote, but not for their usernames.

    You might try opening the regular CTRL-F box. Which you can do. But you can only search in the tiny fraction of the page that's currently visible, for some reason.

    Why would anyone possibly want to do this? Just keep the page loaded when you scroll somewhere else, it would both be better and less development work.

    They have all the UI primitives right there, but they choose to discard them and then re-implement them as poor hacks, breaking any niche functionalities and introducing whole new classes of issues that weren't there before, like loading times WHILE SCROLLING, or how about LAG becomes an issue for a bloody forum software.

    Man, I hate discourse.

    /rant
    CaptainJistuce
    Posted by tomman
    I. Am. Not. Going. To. Install. Browser. Addons.

    End of story.

    I'm also not interested into those idealist hardcore nerd "read only computer" model. I'm happy with my current setup, and would change nothing of it.
    Gotta admit, it was a lot harder to hack the OS when we ran out of ROM.
    tomman I. Am. Not. Going. To. Install. Browser. Addons.

    End of story.

    I'm also not interested into those idealist hardcore nerd "read only computer" model. I'm happy with my current setup, and would change nothing of it.
    ‮strfry("emanresu")
    Posted by tomman

    What I meant to say: I refuse to install browser addons, period.

    Ad blocking should be done at the NETWORK level, communism-style. I have several devices at home, most of them running multiple OS, some of them that I don't manage, so maintaining an adblocking solution that requires client setup is not something I'm willing to do. I get that adblockers, script blockers and user scripts do allow more fine grained control for those pests, but once again, life is too short for spend your time meddling with web browsers and addons.

    But why? I definitely hate configuration and tinkering too (the ideal system would have / as read-only with a tmpfs overlay and only /home persistent, with any log files I didn't explicitly request wiped on shutdown), but installing uBlock and applying whatever default lists seem pertinent takes something like five minutes. Just how often do you install software anyway?

    I suppose a solution might be to install a new root certificate, then MITM all traffic going to these domains to either serve up empty files with 200 OK. If it's to be done without any configuration at all, a simpler approach might be to have them resolve to an IP where nothing is listening on port 80, leaving the connection connecting forever, instead of giving NXDOMAIN. But neither of these approaches would work for any of the examples in this thread.

    Or, there is one solution, but you'd probably hate it: Firefox Sync. Log in once whenever you've installed Firefox/Seamonkey (I believe it even prompts you), then you're done.
    tomman
    Posted by sureanem
    >Slashdot infoboxes scrolling break if you adblock, making impossible to participate in polls from the front page.

    Works fine on my machine. What ad blocker and lists are you using?

    This, to generate a custom BIND RPZ zone file for my routerbox. The used blocklists are detailed on the README (additional suggestions welcome!)

    Posted by creaothceann
    Posted by tomman
    I refuse to install more browser addons like Greasemonkey

    ?

    What I meant to say: I refuse to install browser addons, period.

    Ad blocking should be done at the NETWORK level, communism-style. I have several devices at home, most of them running multiple OS, some of them that I don't manage, so maintaining an adblocking solution that requires client setup is not something I'm willing to do. I get that adblockers, script blockers and user scripts do allow more fine grained control for those pests, but once again, life is too short for spend your time meddling with web browsers and addons.
    ‮strfry("emanresu") >Slashdot infoboxes scrolling break if you adblock, making impossible to participate in polls from the front page.

    Works fine on my machine. What ad blocker and lists are you using?
    creaothceann
    Posted by tomman
    I refuse to install more browser addons like Greasemonkey

    ?
    tomman Slashdot infoboxes scrolling break if you adblock, making impossible to participate in polls from the front page.

    They use some jQuery fuckery to set "position:fixed" or something on that container DIV if some ad DIVs can't be found, tied to the onscroll event. Dealing with that from the developer tools is a PITA because jQuery (and because I refuse to install more browser addons like Greasemonkey). Therefore I no longer participate in polls.

    WHAT THE FUCK, VA Software Dice BIZX!?!

    But hey, this is not as evil as the whole #FuckBeta fiasco.
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