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    tomman MS officially stopped allowing W7/8 keys to activate Windows 10:
    https://devicepartner.microsoft.com/en-us/communications/comm-windows-ends-installation-path-for-free-windows-7-8-upgrade

    Also, MS stopped selling new Win10 licenses since January 2023, so this leaves two possible options for those looking to downupgrade to Windows Vista 2 Me 3.0 11:

    - Buy a new Windows 11 license for $200 (may be cheaper on some markets)
    - Activate using a existing Win10 license.

    I'm glad my Windows needs in this house are confined to the realm of retrocomputing, but if I were a modern AAA+ gamer, I would be seriously rethinking my game tastes. Windows 11 is simply not worth it, no matter the usecase.
    Nicholas Steel
    Posted by tomman
    You're still limited by the SATA port speeds, and in sequential reads the difference between a HDD and SSD is minimal, but sequential reads are not the most usual operation your OS will do everyday.


    The biggest benefit really is the ability to read/write multiple things simultaneously. You can have your anti-virus scan your SSD while a game is loading data from the same SSD and experience virtually no negative impact caused by the storage device! or Windows decides to start doing a check for Windows Updates or something while you're gaming, or everything wants to load at the same time during Windows log-in... all of these greatly improved by an SSD's ability to handle multiple things simultaneously.
    tomman As someone that has already installed a fair number of SATA SSDs on machines that are (sadly) not mine, getting rid of the random R/W performance bottleneck of rust spinners IS completely worth the price of admission. As a bonus you get to save power, which on a laptop means a few minutes of extra runtime, even on a worn battery.

    You're still limited by the SATA port speeds, and in sequential reads the difference between a HDD and SSD is minimal, but sequential reads are not the most usual operation your OS will do everyday.

    I now even want SSDs on my retroboxes, thanks~ Once you taste the forbidden fruit, there is no going back. For now I'm stalled for the most obvious r€a$on... but hopefully Soon™....
    Kawaoneechan DiskLED? I knew I forgot something when I got my new laptop!
    creaothceann
    Posted by Nicholas Steel
    3) It's super quiet, so when a rogue program starts thrashing the SSD you won't know unless you open Task Manager or something!

    This is why I use DiskLED and NetSpeedMonitor (up to Win10, setup program needs to run in Win7 compatibility mode) to see more of what's going on at a glance.
    Nicholas Steel SATA SSD's are a million times better than a SATA HDD. Why?

    1) Multiple reads/writes can occur simultaneously!
    2) Time spent seeking is virtually non-existent.
    3) It's super quiet, so when a rogue program starts thrashing the SSD you won't know unless you open Task Manager or something!
    CaptainJistuce SATA flash drives aren't appreciably faster than a half-decent disk, and I have limited capacity for NVMe-based drives.

    I ain't payin' double the price for disk to get disk-like performance.
    wertigon Meanwhile cheap 4TB SSD bulk drives has dropped to $179 now... A system from 5 years ago usually got less storage than that, but of course there will be exceptions. Samsung 850 QVOs 8TB SSDs are $450 now, too. These things are starting to become affordable, but not at the dirt cheap level of HDDs yet.

    For gaming 8TB is more than you need right now, but I would say 32TB need to come down to affordable levels before we have enough storage overall. As always, you do what you feel is best, I can only tell you what I see. Feel free to disagree, it's your system, files, and money after all! :)

    https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08DTR8RGR
    CaptainJistuce
    Posted by tomman
    Why not mix and match then?

    Keep the rust spinners for the legally acquired media, and use the solid storage for your OS, applications, and frequently accessed files.

    If you're at home, your rust spinners are just a cable away. And if you're away... plan ahead!

    That's what I do. Booting off a flash drive, with frequently-used applications stored there too. Real disks for my dragon's hoard of data as well as less-frequently-hit programs where load times are less galling.
    tomman Why not mix and match then?

    Keep the rust spinners for the legally acquired media, and use the solid storage for your OS, applications, and frequently accessed files.

    If you're at home, your rust spinners are just a cable away. And if you're away... plan ahead!
    CaptainJistuce
    Posted by wertigon

    For me, a 2 TB SSD is large enough. I don't need more storage on my system. Sure, for backup drives and so on, larger is better - but 2 TB SSDs cost less than $130 today! Once they drop below $99 it will be game over for the HDD, for real.

    Also, Windows 11 still allows spinning rust, it just won't install to one. Thus, a modern system has one of two viable paths:

    #1 - a 250 GB SSD + 2 TB HDD. Cost: $61,98
    #2 - a 1 TB SSD. Cost: $64.99

    The 1TB system will be better in every conceivable way except it doesn't have that 1.25 TB extra storage. Does that even matter though?
    Honestly? I have a quarter-TB of just music.
    My legally-acquired videos directory, which is mostly anime fansubs, is over two TB.

    The extra storage matters. Yes, I could just delete everything and use streaming services exclusively. But it doesn't seem like a good deal to delete all of my hoard so I can pay to use someone else's hoard instead.
    wertigon
    Posted by tomman
    https://www.theregister.com/2023/04/28/no_more_updates_for_windows_10/

    Win10 has been sentenced to death by MS - no more feature updates from now on, only security patches. Starting October 14th, 2025, it's Windows 11 or nothing.

    If you can afford the MS-sanctioned metal to run it, go nuts. If you can't or won't collaborate with the global pandemic of e-waste, then Win10 is the new Win7 is the new WinXP is the new Win98 is the new DOS.


    Oh, it was sentenced to death years ago. It just had to give due process for appelation courts and whatnot to run it's course, so they don't accidentally sentence an innocent OS to death. Because MS would never do that! Right?
    tomman https://www.theregister.com/2023/04/28/no_more_updates_for_windows_10/

    Win10 has been sentenced to death by MS - no more feature updates from now on, only security patches. Starting October 14th, 2025, it's Windows 11 or nothing.

    If you can afford the MS-sanctioned metal to run it, go nuts. If you can't or won't collaborate with the global pandemic of e-waste, then Win10 is the new Win7 is the new WinXP is the new Win98 is the new DOS.
    Nicholas Steel Double Wertigon's price list numbers for SSD costs if you're living in Australia (triple the 250 and 500GB costs).
    creaothceann LTT had a talk show segment about that: https://youtu.be/04aNA5rLXEk?t=105

    Conclusion: higher numbers wins more dumb customers
    wertigon Seriously, these are the SATA SSD prices in piggie America according to PC part picker (cheapest SATA SSD vs cheapest spinning rust of same capacity - e.g. a LOT of 5400 RPM drives here)


    +----------+-------------+---------+---------+
    | Size | SSD | HDD | Premium |
    +----------+-------------+---------+---------+
    | 128 GB | $17.79 | --- | --- |
    | 250 GB | $24.99 | $12.99 | 1,924 |
    | 500 GB | $39.99 | $17.99 | 2,223 |
    | 1000 GB | $64.99 | $32.99 | 1,967 |
    | 2000 GB | $129.99 | $36.99 | 3,514 |
    | 4000 GB | $319.99 | $49.99 | 6,401 |
    | 8000 GB | $699.99 | $144.99 | 4,828 |
    | 16000 GB | $1599.99 | $279.99 | 5,714 |
    +----------+-----------+-----------+---------+


    For me, a 2 TB SSD is large enough. I don't need more storage on my system. Sure, for backup drives and so on, larger is better - but 2 TB SSDs cost less than $130 today! Once they drop below $99 it will be game over for the HDD, for real.

    Also, Windows 11 still allows spinning rust, it just won't install to one. Thus, a modern system has one of two viable paths:

    #1 - a 250 GB SSD + 2 TB HDD. Cost: $61,98
    #2 - a 1 TB SSD. Cost: $64.99

    The 1TB system will be better in every conceivable way except it doesn't have that 1.25 TB extra storage. Does that even matter though?

    Conclusion: If you are too cheap to spend $20 on a 128 GB NVMe boot drive, then Windows 11 is not for you. And yes, your system will support NVMe boot if you can run Windows 11 otherwise.
    CaptainJistuce BRING BACK CORE MEMORY!

    Surprisingly close to reality.
    tomman https://www.tomshardware.com/news/microsofts-reportedly-trying-to-kill-hdd-boot-drives-for-windows-11-pcs-by-2023

    Starting next year, MS wants OEMs to kill spinners for real: it's SSD or no W11 licenses for your next Brand-Name PC™.

    I... am full in agree with this measure. Once you try the pleasure of "almost like RAM" solid storage performance, you simply don't go back. I HOPE that 2023 is the year I finally start moving my metal to SSD (I guess there is little hope for the PATA boxes unless someone magically floods the Soviet Venezuelan market with cheap adapters, but for all the SATA boxes, I'm sick of shitty Ez-Break™ WD/Suckgate/Toshitba spinners, or unobtanium new-old-stock Samsung/Hitachi that it's already 10 years old at least).

    But of course, the only ones complaining are paranoid nutters ("teh evil M$ is telling me what to do with my computerizers!!!!"), pennypinching bastards still buying new "crazy supermarket deal" laptops with spinny rust, people living in embargoed Soviet shitholes (and even then, you can now have a half-TB SSD for as low as $50 here if you don't mind using a noname brand AND having a competent backup strategy), and Concerned Citizens™ about e-waste/planned obsolescence/the war at Ukraine/China Pest/China invading Taiwan/"I once bought a SSD and died fast, therefore SSDs over my dead body".

    Bring it on, MS. I'm still not using W11, but the move to SSDs is long overdue.
    CaptainJistuce
    Posted by Kawa
    Posted by desudesu
    I believe it also relies on HTML applications for some of the core interface such as the welcome screen.
    I'm looking at the welcome screen source code right now and I'm afraid it's not just an HTML application but DirectUI, which admittedly does use some form of HTML and CSS.
    I thought for a second you meant the Windows 11 source code. Was just "damn, that was fast".
    Kawaoneechan
    Posted by desudesu
    I believe it also relies on HTML applications for some of the core interface such as the welcome screen.
    I'm looking at the welcome screen source code right now and I'm afraid it's not just an HTML application but DirectUI, which admittedly does use some form of HTML and CSS.
      Main » Discussion » Windows 11 » New reply
      Yes, it's an ad.